so, now we are gonna try to hang em?
Well, this is really special. A US based human rights organization, (the Center for Constitutional Rights) and at least one European based group are trying to convince prosecutors in Germany to investigate and prosecute Donald Rumsfeld for war crimes in connection with reported incidents in Iraq and in Cuba.
First let me say that I could not give any less of a sh*t about Rumsfeld than I do right now, and don't really care what happens to him or his reputation. That being said, who the f**k are these people? The Center for Constitutional Rights, based here in the US of A, should recognize that the Constitution is applicable to the US government and is enforcable by US courts. They should have the stones to bring this up in a domestic forum. Next, who the hell is Germany to be involved in this? They were not a part of the coalition that went into Iraq, and besides having an opinion and an attitude, they have contributed not one bit either to the war effort or to the humanitarian effort to mitigate the impact of the war on Iraqi citizens. None of the incidents cited took place on German soil or territory. If they choose to go ahead with this, they will succeed only in undermining their own standing in the world, (they really can't do much more damage to us than we have done to ourselves.
Do these folks know that the election is over and the Bush administration got thumped? Now is the time for substantive action to ease the plight of the Iraqi people, without judgement, politics, prosletyzing or finger-pointing, (we have a new Congress for that stuff).
With all due respect, Germany, a nation of much accomplishment, (some of it proud, some not), needs to take the same stance that they took while all this was transpiring. The Center for Constitutional Law needs to take a stand here, where it counts, or just go away.
Today's tune is for Woozie.
First let me say that I could not give any less of a sh*t about Rumsfeld than I do right now, and don't really care what happens to him or his reputation. That being said, who the f**k are these people? The Center for Constitutional Rights, based here in the US of A, should recognize that the Constitution is applicable to the US government and is enforcable by US courts. They should have the stones to bring this up in a domestic forum. Next, who the hell is Germany to be involved in this? They were not a part of the coalition that went into Iraq, and besides having an opinion and an attitude, they have contributed not one bit either to the war effort or to the humanitarian effort to mitigate the impact of the war on Iraqi citizens. None of the incidents cited took place on German soil or territory. If they choose to go ahead with this, they will succeed only in undermining their own standing in the world, (they really can't do much more damage to us than we have done to ourselves.
Do these folks know that the election is over and the Bush administration got thumped? Now is the time for substantive action to ease the plight of the Iraqi people, without judgement, politics, prosletyzing or finger-pointing, (we have a new Congress for that stuff).
With all due respect, Germany, a nation of much accomplishment, (some of it proud, some not), needs to take the same stance that they took while all this was transpiring. The Center for Constitutional Law needs to take a stand here, where it counts, or just go away.
Today's tune is for Woozie.
posted by eccentric recluse at 6:40 PM
15 Comments:
Well, I don't see why they can't try Rumsfeld for these crimes. Didn't the United States already set a precedent for this when we decided to go over to Iraq and pass judgement on a foreign people and their leaders? Didn't we punish Saddam in 1991/1992 for doing essentially the same thing we did over the last few years?
Reasoning that the U.S. cannot be accountable internationally only works in a global dictatorship - the guy at the top can meddle in the affairs of the lower classes, but his own rules do not apply to himself.
However, we are not the dictator of the global community - we are merely a participant, albeit an important one.
String the fucker up!!!
Oh, and get rid of that Hendrix crap. I could barely type my last comment through my sudden urge to sleep heavily.
Like I noted, I don't care what happens to the guy---he could be the tragic vivtim of a bus wreck for all I care, but this is not an 'international' effort, it is a special interest group in the US that can't get a lot of press at home. As for Germany, they have yet to bite, but if they did I would want to know how they claim jurisdiction.
E_R
oh, yeah. Hendrix crap? sorry, my Donnie & Marie records are being washed....
It's not right when we meddle uninvited in other countries' affairs, and not right when they do it to us. Of all the countries, Germany (the Nazis) are in no position to judge us morally. As for that special interest group or whatever they are, i agree they should go through proper channels with their complaint... the little weasels.
WASHINGTON: The Central Intelligence Agency has acknowledged for the first time the existence of two classified documents, including one signed by President George W. Bush, that have guided the agency's interrogation and detention of terror suspects.
(snip)
The contents of the documents were not revealed, but one document, as described by the ACLU, is "a directive signed by President Bush granting the CIA the authority to set up detention facilities outside the United States and outlining interrogation methods that may be used against detainees."
The second document, according to the group is a Justice Department legal analysis "specifying interrogation methods that the CIA may use against top Al Qaeda members."
ER, This is a bit from new story from the NY Times. I know not one thing about the org. that is trying to bring charges in Germany but I do believe we know very litte about the criminal activites bushco has done in our name.
It may just turn out that the German gov. gave a helping hand in some of this.
Oh, and I enjoy the music you pick!!
JB
I agree that we know damn little, and I admit that I am operating on the assumption that these circumstances will soon be mitigated by the presence of a more powerful regulating force, (a new Congress).
I hadn't considered the possibility that Germany may be up to its collective asses in this as well. If I was guessing, (and I am), I would say not. The most likely suspects are eastern european or possibly middle eastern, (countries with a grudge against Saddam and Osama).
Anyway, we will see how it plays out.
Got any requests for backing tracks?
E_R
Sure, I was just looking through the cd's and the Allman Brothers sounds like a good pick. I went with my daughter and saw Tom Petty and wouldn't mind hearing that here. I love blues...you ever run across Freddie King that would be great too.....
I just got an update from Smokin Joe Kubek web site and he's coming to town the end of December. I'd highly recommend him.
JB
Who cares about procecuting Rumsfeld. Just be glad he is out of office!
Pud-right on! I don't thin there is enough justice in the world for this guy, just need to render him and his boss irrelevant.
E_R
sorry, my Donnie & Marie records are being washed....
Talk is cheap...(I'm a little bit country...I'm a little bit rock and roll...I'm a little bit nauseous.)
re the actual topic, if Rummy or other various Bushco people committed crimes, would it not be a good thing to make a show of bringing them to justice? I ask that not hypothetically. Just wondering how such a show might fit in with future foreign policy. It's too late to try to make this shit smell like pineapple, so we could go for the other angle.
-Roy
You might have a point, (no you do have a point), but it is still beyond me that an interest group in the US attempts to interest a foreign government who has, (on the surface anyway), maintained a more than safe distance from this whole affair. They have no legal jurisdiction, no standing in this matter. If the Center for Constitutional Law had a case to make, it should be in a domestic forum, if the world in fact agrees with that position, they should reconvene the Nuremburg Courts.
My point, (whatever it was), was that this appears to be instigated by a small group of Americans who seem not to be getting their fair share of press, what with the elections and all. There are very significant symbolic points to be made here, they are just making a mess of making them.
E_R
It occurs to me that the Center for Constitutional Law may just see what passes for the law of the land here and now, with this sitting President, and does not think their case will get a fair hearing...or a hearing at all, in this country.
Remember this, bushco. are law breakers, they will stop at nothing to keep themselves in power. And they have already thumbed their collective noses at the Constitution (just a goddamn piece of paper!!!)
Whatever forces can be brought to bear against this bunch should be used so they can be stopped dead in their tracks!
Do I sound mad? All this talk, before the election, of being a terror enabler if you dare disagee with bushco makes me mad.
JB
http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/2006/11/germanys-claim-to-universal-power-over.html
A little more about Germany if anyone's interested.
JB
The Greenwald blog is a good source of info!
Yes, it is possible that the CCL might believe that it won't get a fair shake in the US, (define "fair"), but if they really believe that, why are they in business at all? Yes, the current regime pushes the envelope in legal terms, (and thats being real polite), but if the law has no standing or jurisdiction here, what are they trying to preserve?
Using a foreign law that takes itself waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyy too seriously is not going to accomplish much.
E_R
I am so gonna rip your balls out sammy baby.
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